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 Posted - February 09 2006 : 7:30:11 PM
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Greetings fellow Mantuaddicts:
Lionel buffs are generally pretty familiar with the "holy grail" point of sale EMD's distributed to Lionel dealers. These big Lionel F's were molded in clear plastic so potential buyers could see the inner workings of their favorite EMD.
Less well-known but more dear to the hearts of HO buffs are the clear plastic unpowered EMD models distributed by Globe models before their acquisition by Athearn. The single-headlight Globe is the father of all the Athearn EMD F's that followed. The clear version was not a hit and much of the inventory appears to have been oversprayed in more saleable liveries (I have a clear F oversprayed in PRR Tuscan). This, of course, makes the clear Globes a prized commodity for Athearn collectors.
Now to the Mantua/Tyco story. Tyco launched their EMD F's in 1958/9 & very quickly offered a myriad of livery choices including a point-of-sale EMD F in clear plastic. Like its big Lionel brother, the point seems to have been to demonstrate the inner workings, specifically, Tyco's new power trucks.
Model Trains magazine has a nice advertisement displaying one of these early clear F's, sporting some nifty red pinstriping on its otherwise see-thru shell. These clear oddballs have appeared occasionally at train shows and once or twice on eBay, but the early "visible" F's are pretty rare birds.
Perhaps even less common is Mantua's post-1978 visible F. The only examples I've seen have been dual-powered and were, I suspect, used as point of sales tools to demonstrate the differences between Mantua's ressurected F's and run-of-the-mill Tyco F's.
There you have it, the scant low-down on some pretty rare birds. Clearly (couldn't resist the bad pun), these visible Mantua/Tycos are animals to be on the lookout for.
Any additional info on the visible F's would be much appreciated.
Magnolia Academy
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Posted - February 18 2006 : 5:51:50 PM
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Hi Mantuaddicts!
Just a brief follow-up on the saga of the see-thru Mantua F's. The earliest magazine reference I could find for the visible F's was the March, 1960, issue of Model Trains. The inside front cover full-page ad, Mantua/Tyco's typical position in M/T for years, shows a naked visible F. The tag-line reads "The INSIDE Story of HO's Greatest Diesel" (Oh, man, MORE bad visible-F puns)!
The copy goes on to state, "Now... as this 'X-Ray' view shows. this new diesel takes its time-honored place beside the finest locos that Mantua-Tyco has ever produced!" (Guess that pretty much says it all.)
Regarding the post-'78 Mantua visible twin-motored F's, I just obtained an example in the typical orange and yellow packaging from the era. Interestingly, the box end contains a catalog ID clearly stating the contents: "411-125 Twin Motored F7 Clear."
Thanks for letting me bend your ear and, as I wrote earlier, any further info on these crystal clear Mantuas would be most welcome!
Magnolia Academy
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Posted - August 06 2006 : 1:40:45 PM
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Clear Plastic Shells,
I picked-up a AHM C-liner shell at a train show. No one seems to know anything about this. It was laying in a parts box and cleaned up nicely once I got it home. Any Info out there?
Thanks
Alco Fan
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Posted - August 07 2006 : 10:27:48 AM
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Alco Fan:
FM C-Liner clear shell? That is intriguing. I went thru my early AHM promotional information and found no mention of such an animal, one supposes to be used as a point-of-purchase trade stimulator similar to Tyco and Lionel see-through EMDs.
The aforementioned might offer a clue.
Is the shell Tempo or Rivarossi C-liner? (I can't vouch for any differences except the Rivarossi shell plastic seems heavier (more dense.)
While I can't find any references in AHM literature to a clear C-Liner, Rivarossi and their connection to Lionel Corporation, which is well-documented, might be the culprit. It also seems just like something the Italian maker would do: their products were quite creatively marketed and they might have taken their cue from Lionel after their (eventually abortive) early HO collaboration with Lionel.
This is all PURE speculation on my part and I merely offer the idea as a suggested route of inquiry. In any event, the clear C-Liner is a find.
MagAc
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Posted - August 07 2006 : 1:30:42 PM
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Magnolia Academy,
I dug out the shell, clear C-liner shell. It still has the copper handrails at the front hatch. It has the 4 conical coolong fans at the back with 2 small exhaust holes in front of those. It has a black disk on the front center just behind the last slanted window of the roof. The number boards are in place but no numbers. It has molded on handrails on all 4 doors. No horns or any markings if AHM or Riv.
I have taken a picture of it but can't find the cable to hook up to the computer and the scan is too light.
I'll send a picture when I can.
Thanks.
Alco Fan
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Posted - August 08 2006 : 10:24:30 PM
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Clear C-liner Shell
I posted a huge, unfortunately, photo of this shell on the AHM loco page. I'll try a smaller one here since you were talking about visible Tyco engines.
Hope this is interesting! Thanks!
Alco Fan
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jlong
Big Six
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Posted - September 06 2006 : 8:52:35 PM
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Be advised Lionel sometimes used up surplus clear plastic from a previous batch run (window inserts for example) to cast locomotive and car bodies which were painted over in standard colors (which may be the case with the Globes and Rivarossi C Liner).
Many of the clear shell Lionel pieces that show up really aren't authentic dealer items. The paint was stripped off by soaking the shells in solutions such as Tide detergent and scrubbing them carefully with a soft toothbrush. Viola, a common piece becomes "rare". With a magnifying glass, one can find paint traces and/or scrub marks however. If the clear plastic isn't yellowed with age, it's almost a sure sign the paint was removed.
John Long
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Posted - October 11 2011 : 5:56:10 PM
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I Get This As A Sales Gimmick, But Why? It Would only Slightly Give Sales A Boost. The Other Prices Charged By Us Who Pay Arms And Legs For These Wern`t Even Sold By The Company When They Fetch These Prices. Athearn Hasent Done One For Their SD70ACe. I Guess It Draws In Modelers And Catches Their Eye Like The EMD Visible F Units.
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Posted - November 27 2011 : 10:31:46 AM
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Alco Fan- would you be interested in selling or trading that FM C-Liner clear shell?
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Posted - November 27 2011 : 10:40:33 PM
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Damn:
Just for a second there I thought MagAc was back.
Oh well. Anyone got his email? See if we can talk him into coming back?
-Gareth
"A is A"
-Aristotle
Law of Identification
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 Posted - November 27 2011 : 11:09:53 PM
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Darn. Why didn't I think to ask first?
The Tyco Depot
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Posted - November 28 2011 : 12:39:16 AM
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OK Guys,
2x4's at Dawn.....!  
-Gareth
"A is A"
-Aristotle
Law of Identification
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Posted - November 28 2011 : 06:23:11 AM
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Somewhere in my collection is a very yellowed clear shell Varney F7 ( I think ). Bought it to use on my Ghost Train project. Was looking for the picture last night, but can't find it.
Jerry
" When life throws you bananas...it's easy to slip up"
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Posted - November 28 2011 : 4:35:24 PM
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I have one of the original (60's) clear F's. Two were made: one with a Canadian Pacific stripe pattern in red (that's the one I have), the other is a Santa Fe warbonnet. It is in fact a dual-drive. I modified mine with LED's and such for my Christmas train. Yeah, nothing like taking a rare item and "ruining" it for enjoyment 
I also have the labeled box for the 70's Mantua version. I don't know what those looked like, but I do know you can tell them apart by the stirrups. The older versions are flush to the carbody; later is a little thicker.
~~~~~~~~~
As for MagAC, I tried back in the day. PM'd him via ebay and may have even had his email at one time. I don't know what happened with him originally, but my timing was bad in seeking his return (apparently Tony Cook tried to contact him as well) and he was none too kind. I know when Todd made logins a requirement to even view or lurk on this forum for the longest time, even that didn't flush him out (unless he created a new name to lurk under). I'd rather not indulge whatever set him off to begin with. A few guys disappeared back then. I'm sure he knows he's missed if he's reading, but going over 4 and close to 5 years now I suspect he's moved on for good.
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Posted - November 28 2011 : 7:03:25 PM
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Hey Tony:
Yeah I tried ferreting him out to....
No luck...
Likely as not he's gone for good.
-Gareth
"A is A"
-Aristotle
Law of Identification
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