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 Posted - February 12 2011 : 5:51:31 PM
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Ok guys, I been back in H&R trains twice and keep seeing these "DCC ready" units for sale. After talking to one of the repair techs, I found out what DCC is. The real question is: forgoing replacing almost every piece of powered stock i own (packs, loco's, accessories) Is there a way to get around the DCC and run just an old school layout? cause i know the more "bling" you stick into something the more stuff can go wrong (sorta like Mr. Scott's statement to Dr. McCoy in Star Trek III: "...the more they overthink the plumbing, the easier it is to stop up the drain"
Does this hold true with DCC. In my eyes less is more.
Opinions?
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Posted - February 12 2011 : 5:55:19 PM
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| hi sundowner,most big makers dcc locos are backwards compatible,ie you can use them on dc layouts ken
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Posted - February 12 2011 : 6:46:18 PM
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My nephew has been buying DCC trains lately. He likes them allot. Showed them to me at Christmas time & they do seem to be pretty cool... But I know very little about them...
Walt
Luck, usually comes dressed in work clothes...
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Posted - February 12 2011 : 10:33:49 PM
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quote:Ok guys, I... keep seeing these "DCC ready" units for sale... The real question is: forgoing replacing almost every piece of powered stock i own (packs, loco's, accessories) Is there a way to get around the DCC and run just an old school layout?
Does this hold true with DCC. In my eyes less is more.
Opinions?
Originally posted by Sundowner - February 12 2011 : 5:51:31 PM
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All DCC units are backwards compatible, ie they will work off straight DC power. And there are still plenty of non-DCC ( stock ) engines for sale out there, too. So you DON'T need to buy more expensive DCC units to run, you can still buy analog DC voltage engines.
For the most part, DCC gives you this one HUGE benefit you can't get with straight DC trains - you can run multiple engines on the same track at the SAME TIME (without the clunky block wiring you used to have to do to a layout). Plus now you also have DCC sound systems to give you extremely realistic engine sounds, diesel or steam. Can't get that with straight DC engines, either. The other benefit of modern engines, DC or DCC, is that they have all-wheel power pick-up, which ups the reliability by many factors. The older engines just can't compare with the more modern , 5-pole skew-wound motors, all-wheel power pickup, and better detailing. The biggest drawback to DCC is the initial expense, which adds $500-1000 to your layout, plus the wiring has to change, you need multiple power packs if your layout is large enough, etc. Bottom line, you can still enjoy your non-DCC system with DCC equipped engines. You dont' need to switch if you DON'T want to.
Jerry
" When life throws you bananas...it's easy to slip up"
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Posted - February 09 2012 : 4:14:15 PM
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I bought a bachmann switcher a few weeks backs and it got me hooked on DCC right then and there. All together, I have about 100 locomotives and only 4 are dcc equipped. They also run on standard dc. as for the little switcher, it came with sound and it worked on dc. You don't get the control of dcc but the loco does run at a certain voltage and runs smooth. On dcc however, the little switcher takes off in notch number 1. I am currently in the process of converting about 60% of my fleet to dcc. Most are Athearn Blue Box and RTR models with some being dcc ready out of the box. I will run conventional dc as well. Best of both worlds.
If you are not having fun, you are not doing it right.
Edited by - raysouthernpac on February 09 2012 4:15:31 PM
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Posted - February 09 2012 : 4:42:58 PM
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Some engines are DCC ready now a days. How ever, some are more harder make DCC'd. You don't need to buy a DCC engine quite yet. Just shop around for DCC stuff and see what'll cost ya to do. Me, I'm a old school DC guy. Be learly when it comes to older stuff IE: Tyco, Mantua, etc. I say stick to the newer brands unless ya wanna remotor your old stuff. Some companies have real DCC ready engines that have the 8-PIN plug to where ya can buy the DCC board and plug it in and set it's settings with a DCC controller.
" Heck with counting 'em rivets, TRAINS ARE FOR FUN! Not called the Mad Scientist for nothing either!"
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Posted - February 09 2012 : 8:00:04 PM
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I'm running an all DCC layout. It started as a DC layout. I didn't change any wiring, I had a wiring bus under the layout and tapped into that for the conversion. I like several things in the DCC arena, first is the lack of wires for the layout. I have 11 switches on the layout, all are controlled by the DCC cab. The switches are wired to 4 stationary decoders. This eliminates the wires from the switch back to the control panel, and eliminates the switch manufactures controller.
When I was on DC all the stalls at my engine facility and round house had to be electrically isolated by insulated rail joiners and have a on-off switch for power, DCC eliminated that too.
Lastly I like the DCC system I have since the cab is wireless. I started with an MRC Prodigy where the cab had to be hard wired to the DCC unit, later I added the MRC wireless upgrade. It's nice to be able to walk around the layout while running trains.
I do have several sound units and do like the sound aspect.
Hope some of this helps.......
Edited by - eaglerock109 on February 09 2012 10:28:30 PM
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Posted - February 09 2012 : 9:49:03 PM
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BIggest headache with DCC is the initial cost, then the conversion. A large layout needs power districts, ie separate power packs for a certain amount of track/trains. The main Brain and parts cost around $300-500 to start for a decent system. Plus the more engines you want to convert, that's an additional 25-50 each, not counting the Sound Decoders.
Since you can run DCC-equipped engines on straight DC voltage, there's no problem there. You can't do the reverse, though .
The biggest plus is the ability to run multiple engines on a single track, plus the addition of realistic sound to the engines. It's like night and day operationally, when you can hear the brakes squeal, the steam cylinders chuff, the turbo-charger kick in on an SD-40-2. Many benefits. Do you want to spend the money or not? that is the question. So far, I have no need to spend that money, as I can run my DCC engines on my club's layout, and our modular layouts at shows. Home use, it's up to you. It's an expensive decision, but one worth doing if you like the realism provided by the new sound decoders and the flexibility offered by multi-operating.
Jerry
" When life throws you bananas...it's easy to slip up"
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Posted - February 10 2012 : 08:51:14 AM
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A huge caveat: actually, not all DCC engines / decoders are backwards compatible... that is, not all of them will work on DC. Most new ones are... but up until say about 2005 this was the exception, not the rule. There are plenty of legacy 1st-gen units and inexpensive decoders out there that will NOT run on DC. I know, as I have a few. However, it was in the vendors' best interests to remove this barrier so again, most of what's been made new since the mid-2000's works on either system.
At the retail level, the price difference between DC and DCC (sound) locos is about $100. For that you get a dual-mode sound decoder and speaker already installed. Amazingly, this is not much more expensive than doing the work yourself: Most sound decoders start at $50, add another $10-20 for speaker, and the remaining balance is more than consumed by your time and aggravation cramming it all in there, which often necessitates modifying the loco's innards.
Is it worth it? I enjoy having a few signature locos with sound. I love the racket of an EMD at idle, the thrashing of a GE at speed, and the happy lugging of an Alco. The personalities of steam are recaptured and my kids love that. As Tom pointed out, you can link an amazing array of accessories to a higher-end system - perfect for larger more interactive layouts.
Installation is not necessarily complex. I built a standard cab-block 4x8 layout in 2002 (holy crap has it been that long???!). In 2006 I added the MRC Prodigy DCC system, which cost $100. I only made a few strategic modifications to the existing layout wiring.... allowing me to run both DCC and DC at the same time, and switch any segment to either bus at the flip of a... switch. Not that it happens often on a mere 4x8, but the proof of concept is sound. For sound! Yay, puns.
A few more notes on DCC engines: They do require more power than non-DC versions - you'll have to crank the throttle to about 5V before most will even think of moving. They are generally more predictable reliable, but clean track is perhaps even more important. Yet because of this, while you can run DCC and DC locos on the same tracks in general terms, you CANNOT run them in the same consist - the power curves are too different, let alone the bus type issues. However, it's easier to get multiple DCC units to run together well, as opposed to DC types' tendency to "fight". Sound units also take up more power, so on a basic system you can only run two locos at once (I have gotten away with 3 but that was pushing it). For multi-unit pulling consists you can try one sound unit, with a few standard-DCC "mutes" (as opposed to "dummies"). For the record, multi-sound units get novelty-killing LOUD really quick ;)
The inexpensive $40-50 Bachmann Easy-DCC engines are DCC-only, no sound. For $50 more you get sound.
So for about $100 I took the plunge to add the capability (I won't say "convert"... there is a key distinction), got a handful of locos I enjoy at whatever price was justifiable, and it's worked very well. I do not feel the need to have all my units as DCC though - that is wholly impractical and unnecessary on several levels. The bulk of my day-to-day fleet is still DC.
Edited by - spiderj76 on February 10 2012 09:00:05 AM
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