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 Posted - May 08 2015 : 8:07:18 PM
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The reason I'm asking is because I was looking at my "Bachmann" GP-18 in Union Pacific livery (from the 80's and 90's) and I found that Mehano made/makes one just like it. Same colors and everything. In fact, the motor is in a similar style as Mehano products, so it's actually quite smooth. I know that it's the original motor because I have a blown up diagram with the loco. Here are some photos.
Here's the Mehano version.
Any ideas?
-Steve
"A lot of modellers out there who go to these train shows see broken HO stuff and go, 'This is useless' when, in reality, they can still be used for modeling whether it's as a prop on your layout or a cool project to make something old new again."
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Posted - May 08 2015 : 8:52:52 PM
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I have no idea Stephen, but going by the photos they sure look identical.
http://tycodepot.com/
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Posted - May 08 2015 : 8:58:21 PM
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quote:I have no idea Stephen, but going by the photos they sure look identical.
Originally posted by JNXT 7707Â -Â May 08 2015Â :Â 8:52:52 PM
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That's what got my puzzled. Not to mention the overall quality of the loco reminds me of earlier Mehano locos before the IHC Premier Series came around.
-Steve
"A lot of modellers out there who go to these train shows see broken HO stuff and go, 'This is useless' when, in reality, they can still be used for modeling whether it's as a prop on your layout or a cool project to make something old new again."
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Posted - May 08 2015 : 11:29:53 PM
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On top of that, it seems like Bachmann never advertised this thing in their catalogs. Hmmm.
-Steve
"A lot of modellers out there who go to these train shows see broken HO stuff and go, 'This is useless' when, in reality, they can still be used for modeling whether it's as a prop on your layout or a cool project to make something old new again."
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Posted - May 08 2015 : 11:39:33 PM
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Mehano made stuff for AHM, Life Like, Model Power, Bachmann, TYCO & Mehano. And I think a few others whose names I forget. MRC most likely is still using some of their molds.
Regards, John
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Posted - May 09 2015 : 01:13:34 AM
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I don't think Mehano built stuff for Botchman after Kader bought Botchman in 85. As a wholly-owned subsidiary of Kader Heavy Industries in (now) PRC, maybe Kader built stuff for Mehano, but not the other way around. Kader makes money off the stupid Americans by making the stuff for their profit. Including the 40% hike to folks who have stuff made by Kader about two months ago.A quote related to me by a former head guy at Botchman years ago... "You stupid Americans. Playing with toys while we industrious Chinese are making money". Gives you some idea of how the process works.
The other question is...what does the bottom of the Botchman unit look like? Or did someone swap contents somewhere along the line?
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Posted - May 09 2015 : 01:20:52 AM
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quote:I don't think Mehano built stuff for Botchman after Kader bought Botchman in 85. As a wholly-owned subsidiary of Kader Heavy Industries in (now) PRC, maybe Kader built stuff for Mehano, but not the other way around. Kader makes money off the stupid Americans by making the stuff for their profit. Including the 40% hike to folks who have stuff made by Kader about two months ago.A quote related to me by a former head guy at Botchman years ago... "You stupid Americans. Playing with toys while we industrious Chinese are making money". Gives you some idea of how the process works.
The other question is...what does the bottom of the Botchman unit look like? Or did someone swap contents somewhere along the line?
Originally posted by ScaleCraft - May 09 2015 : 01:13:34 AM
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 But yeah, I already have a picture of the bottom of this thing and it just says "Made in Yugoslavia" and a triangle thing.
-Steve
"A lot of modellers out there who go to these train shows see broken HO stuff and go, 'This is useless' when, in reality, they can still be used for modeling whether it's as a prop on your layout or a cool project to make something old new again."
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Posted - May 09 2015 : 11:50:10 AM
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quote: quote:I don't think Mehano built stuff for Botchman after Kader bought Botchman in 85. As a wholly-owned subsidiary of Kader Heavy Industries in (now) PRC, maybe Kader built stuff for Mehano, but not the other way around. Kader makes money off the stupid Americans by making the stuff for their profit. Including the 40% hike to folks who have stuff made by Kader about two months ago.A quote related to me by a former head guy at Botchman years ago... "You stupid Americans. Playing with toys while we industrious Chinese are making money". Gives you some idea of how the process works.
The other question is...what does the bottom of the Botchman unit look like? Or did someone swap contents somewhere along the line?
Originally posted by ScaleCraft - May 09 2015 : 01:13:34 AM
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But yeah, I already have a picture of the bottom of this thing and it just says "Made in Yugoslavia" and a triangle thing.
Originally posted by kovacste000Â -Â May 09 2015Â :Â 01:20:52 AM
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I could not tell from your photos what was what. The gear towers I see in the Botched Instructions look like the same old circular file fodder you usually see.
There are various Botchman Branches. The UK branch did a joint venture in another scale with another company....but all the other companies stuff was made by Kader anyway.
If this was made before the big changeover to Kader production, yeah.
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Posted - May 09 2015 : 12:33:27 PM
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quote: quote: quote:I don't think Mehano built stuff for Botchman after Kader bought Botchman in 85. As a wholly-owned subsidiary of Kader Heavy Industries in (now) PRC, maybe Kader built stuff for Mehano, but not the other way around. Kader makes money off the stupid Americans by making the stuff for their profit. Including the 40% hike to folks who have stuff made by Kader about two months ago.A quote related to me by a former head guy at Botchman years ago... "You stupid Americans. Playing with toys while we industrious Chinese are making money". Gives you some idea of how the process works.
The other question is...what does the bottom of the Botchman unit look like? Or did someone swap contents somewhere along the line?
Originally posted by ScaleCraft - May 09 2015 : 01:13:34 AM
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But yeah, I already have a picture of the bottom of this thing and it just says "Made in Yugoslavia" and a triangle thing.
Originally posted by kovacste000Â -Â May 09 2015Â :Â 01:20:52 AM
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I could not tell from your photos what was what. The gear towers I see in the Botched Instructions look like the same old circular file fodder you usually see.
There are various Botchman Branches. The UK branch did a joint venture in another scale with another company....but all the other companies stuff was made by Kader anyway.
If this was made before the big changeover to Kader production, yeah.
Originally posted by ScaleCraft - May 09 2015 : 11:50:10 AM
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It doesn't say anything about Kader on this thing, the box, or the instructions. However, the sheet does state it is made in Yugoslavia and there are also instructions in Spanish. This is leading me to believe that this might be a more modern era Bachmann because you gotta remember, Mehano did take a lot of engines from other companies back then i.e Pemco GG1, Tyco 2-8-0/0-8-0, and some others. This engine might've been one of them. In fact, I looked at one of my Mehano units (an IHC Premier Series C-415) and it has a very similar mechanism to the GP-18 so I think after Bachmann stopped making these things in the 90's, Mehano got ahold of the rights for it. It's happened before with a number of other companies.
-Steve
"A lot of modellers out there who go to these train shows see broken HO stuff and go, 'This is useless' when, in reality, they can still be used for modeling whether it's as a prop on your layout or a cool project to make something old new again."
Edited by - kovacste000 on May 09 2015 12:37:20 PM
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Posted - May 09 2015 : 2:07:20 PM
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French. Not Spanish. Bachmann Europe.
By 1985 Bachmann had established agencies in Corcieux, France, and also in Bologna, Italy.
Yet, surprisingly for those who have never had to deal deeply with the PRC company...the contact information remains Philadelphia....
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Posted - May 09 2015 : 4:47:20 PM
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Stephen, to answer your thread title, yes.
I'm not sure if there was any other Mehano rolling stock that made it into the Bachmann line, but their GP18 was definitely one of them (tho I wasn't aware of this myself until 2 years ago). It's the same one that they tooled up for AHM in the 70's. I'm not sure when they sold them, but my guess would be somewhere in the 80's up through the 90's. Perhaps they just wanted to expand their diesel roster, or maybe it was when they were moving away from the pancake drives and wanted a more reliable all-wheel drive loco, much like Tyco did when they got fed up with the PT driven Chattanooga and replaced it with a makeshift Mehano 0-8-0. Mehano may also have been looking for a distributor when AHM went belly up... just a guess.
The rule of thumb is that if it says Yugoslavia, then it's a Mehano, regardless of the name on the box or other ID on the underside. There were no other Yugoslavian model train manufacturers, and over the years they made things for just about everyone else, even Atlas N scale.
http://modeltrains.about.com/b/2008/03/06/say-what-you-will-about-mehano.htm
http://www.ebay.com/gds/AHM-IHC-ATT-RSO-TEMPO-IZOLA-ATEST-MODEL-TRAINS-/10000000009947160/g.html
This guy's first video is how I found out they were made for Bachmann, which he mentions either in another video or in the comments somewhere. Their motor speed is pretty consistent to allow for stunts like these on DC. 
The Tyco Depot
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Posted - May 09 2015 : 6:01:55 PM
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Don't forget that Bachmann built for other manufacturers, most notably Lionel in their second 1970's iteration. The Lionel GP30 and GS4 were Bachmann built.
Bachmann also built AHM's little side tank 0-6-0 for a while; it's the one we refer to as the Kader 0-6-0.
Kris Carver-Seaboyer
Modelling the Grafton Terminal Railway, set in New Brunswick, Canada in the 1978-1984 time frame
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Posted - May 09 2015 : 6:06:59 PM
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Yep, they also built the AHM FT, but I was focusing on the origin of this GP18.
The Tyco Depot
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Posted - May 09 2015 : 6:12:36 PM
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To shift back to the original topic, your Bachmann GP18 is of early 90's vintage as per the box style, and is indeed Mehano built. It uses the same trucks as the Mehano built Model Power F7 and the same motor as the C628, RS11 and the steamers. It's an eight wheel drive setup that's smooth and reliable if somewhat choppy at slow speeds.
Kris Carver-Seaboyer
Modelling the Grafton Terminal Railway, set in New Brunswick, Canada in the 1978-1984 time frame
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Posted - May 09 2015 : 6:42:40 PM
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quote:To shift back to the original topic, your Bachmann GP18 is of early 90's vintage as per the box style, and is indeed Mehano built. It uses the same trucks as the Mehano built Model Power F7 and the same motor as the C628, RS11 and the steamers. It's an eight wheel drive setup that's smooth and reliable if somewhat choppy at slow speeds.
Originally posted by graftonterminalrr - May 09 2015 : 6:12:36 PM
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I knew it, honestly. It fits everything you said about them there. Oh, and not to mention, I got the thing for $12 a couple of years ago.
-Steve
"A lot of modellers out there who go to these train shows see broken HO stuff and go, 'This is useless' when, in reality, they can still be used for modeling whether it's as a prop on your layout or a cool project to make something old new again."
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Posted - May 10 2015 : 12:29:54 AM
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Yep, I remember noticing Bachmann using the Mehano GP18 in a few train sets. I'm guessing they did this because they knew at the time their regular line of locomotives had crappy pancake motors, and before they could come up with their own higher-quality locomotives, they used that to fill the gap on some train sets. Interestingly, the GP18 usually was found in more full-featured train sets (I saw a Target-exclusive train set from the early 90s on eBay with the Union Pacific GP18; it included a figure-8 over/under track layout, the dual crossing gate, various Plasticville buildings and accessories, and the train of course had a Target boxcar.)
As for the Bachmann/A.H.M. connection, I remember seeing A.H.M. rebrand Bachmann's N-scale crossing gate as their own in the 80s (they still made their own HO crossing gate, the one with the two parallel gates and the TYCO Signal Man-style crossbucks.) Also starting in the 80s, Life-Like rebranded Bachmann's N-scale crossing gate as well. Then they made a Power-Loc version in the late 90s that was slightly fashioned off of it.
And of course, we remember when Life-Like sometimes rebranded Mehano locomotives in the 70s and 80s. I recall during the 80s, they sold their Alco C628 and FP45 as a more "premium" locomotive with 8-wheel drive (compared to their other diesels using the "Power Drive" pancake motors at the time.) In fact, a few times on eBay, I've seen Life-Like sell the Mehano 2-8-2 steam locomotive under the SceneMaster brand name! (Back then, their SceneMaster line was meant for more hobby-quality products, and those Mehano steam locomotives were of a somewhat higher quality than Life-Like's own steamers of the time.)
Now Bachmann doesn't need to rebrand other companies' locomotives anymore of course, as their locomotives are much improved. I even discovered that my Bachmann BNSF DCC GP40 actually has flywheels! (And this is in their "regular" line, too!)
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Posted - May 10 2015 : 12:58:56 AM
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quote:Yep, I remember noticing Bachmann using the Mehano GP18 in a few train sets. I'm guessing they did this because they knew at the time their regular line of locomotives had crappy pancake motors, and before they could come up with their own higher-quality locomotives, they used that to fill the gap on some train sets. Interestingly, the GP18 usually was found in more full-featured train sets (I saw a Target-exclusive train set from the early 90s on eBay with the Union Pacific GP18; it included a figure-8 over/under track layout, the dual crossing gate, various Plasticville buildings and accessories, and the train of course had a Target boxcar.)
As for the Bachmann/A.H.M. connection, I remember seeing A.H.M. rebrand Bachmann's N-scale crossing gate as their own in the 80s (they still made their own HO crossing gate, the one with the two parallel gates and the TYCO Signal Man-style crossbucks.) Also starting in the 80s, Life-Like rebranded Bachmann's N-scale crossing gate as well. Then they made a Power-Loc version in the late 90s that was slightly fashioned off of it.
And of course, we remember when Life-Like sometimes rebranded Mehano locomotives in the 70s and 80s. I recall during the 80s, they sold their Alco C628 and FP45 as a more "premium" locomotive with 8-wheel drive (compared to their other diesels using the "Power Drive" pancake motors at the time.) In fact, a few times on eBay, I've seen Life-Like sell the Mehano 2-8-2 steam locomotive under the SceneMaster brand name! (Back then, their SceneMaster line was meant for more hobby-quality products, and those Mehano steam locomotives were of a somewhat higher quality than Life-Like's own steamers of the time.)
Now Bachmann doesn't need to rebrand other companies' locomotives anymore of course, as their locomotives are much improved. I even discovered that my Bachmann BNSF DCC GP40 actually has flywheels! (And this is in their "regular" line, too!)
Originally posted by wiley209Â -Â May 10 2015Â :Â 12:29:54 AM
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 Sure, Bachmann still makes cheap stuff, but they're still pretty dang good. Heck, even the low quality Bachmanns of today (train set stuff) I believe have flywheels.
-Steve
"A lot of modellers out there who go to these train shows see broken HO stuff and go, 'This is useless' when, in reality, they can still be used for modeling whether it's as a prop on your layout or a cool project to make something old new again."
Edited by - kovacste000 on May 10 2015 12:59:14 AM
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Posted - May 10 2015 : 7:53:09 PM
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Been doing some research. I know Bach EU or Bach UK was involved. Found a thread on ModelRailForums that stated this in 2009:
"Mehano and Bachmann are not the same company. (at least not this week!) Bachmann UK are the official UK importers of mehano but the involvement stops there."
That falls in line with my understanding having worked with the Philly Folks for years. The Philly address was put on everything, but you don't usually find French in US instructions from that time period.
So far as I know (today), Kader has not purchased Mehano, altho at one time they were hot to "own" the hobby...even tried to make an offer on Marklin while it was coming out of bankruptcy protection.
My guess is this was done in EU or UK, shipped to the US and sold.
Still researching.
And remember you can find anything you want to support your ideas on the algore.
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