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 Posted - October 13 2013 : 10:18:36 AM
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For my LOTW offering:
This HO scale model locomotive has two historic names. "Betsy" of the Polson Logging Co locomotive and it originally was the Northern Pacific "Minnetonka".
The Minnetonka was built by Smith and Porter, of Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania (my hometown), in 1869. It was sold for $6700 to the North Pacific Railroad in 1870 to be used to help build the transcontinental railroad. In 1886 the wood-burning locomotive was sold to the Polson Logging Company, Hoquiam, Washington. It was used to pull log trains. They named her "Old Betsy". In 1920 the locomotive was found in the woods rusting away like a discarded bunch of scrap. In 1933 Northern Pacific purchased and restored it for display at various civic functions. When BNSF took over, "Old Betsy" was placed on permanent loan to the Lake Superior Railroad Museum in Duluth, Minnesota. Today it is on public display looking like a brand new Minnetonka, named after Minnetonka, Minnesota.
I purchased the model last week in eBay for $45 total inc s/h. When I saw it, I had recognized the similarities with other Ken Kidder models, but I had never before seen this exact model. I did not look close enough to notice that it was hand made. This can be seen in the rivet details not being perfectly spaced and aligned like a machine would do.
Below is a reply to an email I received yesterday morning. It was from a gentleman in Japan to whom I had sold an early Tenshodo brass and die cast 0-6-0 to last year. Monday, Via email, I had requested his assistance in identifying this locomotive. I did not know at that time that he was at one time a publisher/editor of Train magazine in Japan as well as the co-author of "The Brown Book" of brass trains. This was his reply:
"Hi, Sean
I had seen the similar model once when I had edited "The Tenshodo Book". The model is preserved in the guest room of Tenshodo, today. I have never seen other piece in Japan.
The model was hand-made by a craftsman who had the contract with the Tenshodo in early stage of their business. It is seemed that the model was resembled to the Northern Pacific's old engine "Minetonkka" which is displayed in the museum in Duluth, Minn, today.
Tenshodo established their model division in 1949. At their starting of the business, they do not have any of the production model except the Dye-casting 0-6-0 tank engine by the New-one Models which I have purchased from you recently.
So they had to made many types of the true hand-built model using various of sub-contractor who were amateur craftsmen. They hand-built each model few pieces up to 10, normally 3-5 pieces. They always did the jobs in full scratch not using Dye-pressing or etching as well as casing parts.
In this model, you can see any of the riveting by hand punched one by one.
At that time, the most of the customer of the Tenshodo were the person in the U.S. Military which was occupied Japan. Not only the own project, Tenshodo had accepted the custom order from these good customers.
Even in Tenshodo, there is no record what types had hand-made in those days, because their hand made craftsmen often finished the order, sometimes, every week.
In the Kawai or the Tetsudo Mokeisha, they also did such type of hand-built accepting the custom orders by the U.S. military person. Some times, one craftsman sold same type of his craft to 2-3 hobbyshops as the contract was so-loose because of not-using any of supplied-parts from their parent company.
Such type hand-built models had lasted to 1952 or 1953. It is seemed that the Ken-Kidder or the International also had purchased these "Un-registered" models in their very early stage through Tenshodo or Tetsudo Mokeisyha.
Then, around 1954-1955, the brass model business turned to "Production model days" such as the FT diesels by Tenshodo or the South Shore steeple cab electric by Kawai.
This is the story which I know about the model you asks me. I believe the model is quite valuable because it is just historical piece in the brass models, beyond the price.
I hope this will help your study even a littele bit.
Best reagrds
Kenichi" (Kenichi Matsumoto)
Such an awesome history lesson!
ă©ăăăăăăšăăăăăŸăă
DĆmo arigatĆgozaimathe other dark meata! Mr. Matsumoto!!
My understanding now of this model is that it probably dates from approx 1950. It is hand made and therefore it is most likely a very limited production, say 10 or more likely 3 to 5 models or less possibly? Finally, it's value is quite high both for it's rarity and more importantly it's historical lineage.
Man, I had a gut feeling about this one! I feel pretty lucky to have picked it up!
Sean
"If everything seems under control, you're not going fast enough!" - Mario Andretti!
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Posted - October 13 2013 : 1:00:42 PM
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A very cool find for sure. Good eye! Love the provenance.
Alco Fan
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 Posted - October 13 2013 : 1:04:53 PM
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Guess I'll throw 1 in here,here we have a set of Pennsy Geep's pullin out from the distillery complex..
[URL=http://s643.photobucket.com/user/tillerman55/media/26827ebf-822e-4574-9519-9500c89e51fb_zps155b7bdd.jpg.html] /tyco/forum/uploaded/yellowiron/26827ebf-822e-4574-9519-9500c89e51fb_zps155b7bdd.jpg [/URL]
I don't always model,but when I do it's in HO,
Stay enthused my friend's...
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Posted - October 13 2013 : 2:01:09 PM
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nice locos there guys,my loco this week,is a name i never hear here,weaver models brass 0-6-0 for rock island in 0 gauge,ken
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Posted - October 13 2013 : 2:33:36 PM
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My LOTW is a recently acquired 1st generation Tyco C630
It's in great condition and even came with the handrail packet. I will be installing those soon.
-Thomas
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Posted - October 13 2013 : 8:27:48 PM
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Mike, that Geep a Spectrum model from Bachmann? (I LOVE the looks of that particular model!) the GP30!
Ken, That 0-6-0 is AWESOME, Brass Weaver, that's different!?
Thomas, that C-630, it has a different TYCO frame, Rivarossi? LOVE the truck side frames!
~John
Many have tried to, and failed, ya just can't repair stupid... 
Do NOT try to Idiot-Proof anything!!!! God, will simply create a better......IDIOT!
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Posted - October 13 2013 : 8:34:05 PM
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So since, I'm already here..... I'll post my own LOTW:
An E-R Models RF-16A....I also have a second by E-R Models:
Nice set of "Sharks".....
~John
Many have tried to, and failed, ya just can't repair stupid...
Do NOT try to Idiot-Proof anything!!!! God, will simply create a better......IDIOT!
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Posted - October 13 2013 : 10:41:48 PM
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quote:For my LOTW offering:
This HO scale model locomotive has two historic names. "Betsy" of the Polson Logging Co locomotive and it originally was the Northern Pacific "Minnetonka".
Originally posted by Mustangs_n_Trains - October 13 2013 : 10:18:36 AM
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Just a coincidence: Last month I was in Duluth for the first time in 21 years and saw the Minnetonka. At the time, I thought it could make a cute model. Now here you are with just such a model.
Carpe Manana!
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UP1259
Switcher
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 Posted - October 18 2013 : 7:26:24 PM
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Well today I received my TYCO Penn Central Alco C430
I was very very exited however, the unit came damaged from transit. :/
I had won a whole lot of "junk" on ebay just to get the PC diesel which still had its original box. The box was a brown box and was marked ALCO CENTURY 430 POWERED - LIGHTED PENN ENTRAL 235G:1600. Well wouldn't you know the seller threw all the JUNK on top of the locomotive including some heavy metal transformers and a bunch of bridge pier junk and cars... the weight caused the brown box with the locomotive to explode and break both airhorns as well as snap off a side truck and scratch the cab by popping a handrail out.  Anyways, I should be happy...the horns can be replaced.. The side frame, I have spares, but I just used some CA and placed the original back on and its holding just fine  The scratch on the firemans side cab where the handrail joins (see picture) I will have to live with,.. but hey for an ancient toy 1 scratch isn't bad for almost NIB. The engine doesn't run and probably needs a re-greasing. The unit appears to have been run little if at all. There is also a hairline crack in a wheel on the power truck. It has a complete set of 5628 numberboards but a 4301 number.. I guess I need to stop being disgruntled, get over the trauma of the way it was packed and appreciate it for what it is.. complete handrails and none missing or bent. I woulda liked the rare 5628 on the side, but it IS kind of neat that its just 5628 number boards... I guess its still a unique piece of HO history for sure.. your thoughts >?
Mike
Huron Locomotive Works
Edited by - UP1259 on October 18 2013 7:29:41 PM
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Posted - October 18 2013 : 8:56:37 PM
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My thoughts? Scratch or no scratch, it's a neat model. I have seen old power torque drives on which the grease was dried up and looked like hard wax. If I had to guess one way or another, I'd say you're right about needing to clean and re-grease.
Carpe Manana!
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Posted - October 18 2013 : 9:27:51 PM
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| What really shocks me is how people buy stuff from eBay and are so willing to accept poorly packaged items. This is why eBay has a terrible reputation. UP1259, what you need to do is contact the seller and tell him you want to either return it or you or if you still really want it you and him can come to an agreement on some sort of partial refund. If they choose not to work with you then you open a case. I can say when it comes to purchasing trains on eBay "I do not play, I expect to get what I pay for".
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Posted - January 01 2014 : 02:17:25 AM
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Nothing like PC mental asylum green to make me happy! What a beautiful locomotive, what a superb save!
JMcNeal
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Posted - January 01 2014 : 02:18:16 AM
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quote:A very cool find for sure. Good eye! Love the provenance.
Originally posted by Alco Fan - October 13 2013 : 1:00:42 PM
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Remarkable piece! Does it run?
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