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 Posted - November 08 2012 : 8:27:44 PM
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I am working on an HO Plymouth MDT refresh and I have two units. One has grabs already installed on either side of the cab door, but they appear substantially oversized; a rough measure comes up with a 3+ inch diameter.
I have .020 (1.74 scale inch diameter) and .025 (2.175 scale inch diameter) wire at the small end of my stock inventory. Without buying another size, which of these is more appropriate to use?
I notice that the .025 is firmer and the .020 is more flexible, although I can work either one fairly easily.
Any feedback would be appreciated.
Siouxlake/ Ron
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Posted - November 08 2012 : 11:27:33 PM
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Ron, the .020" is closer to scale. I think .015" is actually prototypical diameter, but harder to work with.
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Posted - November 09 2012 : 03:43:12 AM
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Ron & Nelson,
I use .015 inch hard music wire, and I don't think its all that difficult to work with....
See:
The ONLY wire grabs I didn't make, is the drop grab irons, those are Tichy, AND the Stanchions, those are factory Athearn metal handrail stanchions.....EVERY other handrail seen I made! From .015 inch hard music wire, as I do, even on my steamers!
I would however suggest the use of a small torch for extreme compound bends in the wire as it gets brittle after a few "tight" bends! Other then that anything thats a simple 90 degree, or a "single" bend, no matter how acute or soft, is relatively, easy!
~John
Many have tried to, and failed, ya just can't repair stupid... 
Do NOT try to Idiot-Proof anything!!!! God, will simply create a better......IDIOT!
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Posted - November 09 2012 : 10:05:45 AM
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 a Slug unity! 
Isn't a Slug technically oh idk a B Unit usually?
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Posted - November 09 2012 : 1:04:01 PM
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John, I have music wire in multiple sizes down to .015", and it hold's its shape very well. The .015" is actually easier to work with because music wire is really stiff, as you said. I was assuming Ron is working with brass wire.
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Posted - November 09 2012 : 4:01:51 PM
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Nelson,
Yeah, I love the stuff it works REALLY well, to say the very least. However sizes, I've got EVERY size from .032 to .005!!!!!
Then to add to it, I got brass from .025 to .002!!!!!
But then with what I get myself into, I don't find the brass to bad, its the other type wire that gets bad to deal with, specially steel or aluminum type!
A word of wisdom from a younger modeler, the music wire, Nelson, you can solder to it! Just as if you were soldering to brass! You wouldn't believe those, that don't know that it is solder-able!
~John
Many have tried to, and failed, ya just can't repair stupid...
Do NOT try to Idiot-Proof anything!!!! God, will simply create a better......IDIOT!
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Posted - November 09 2012 : 4:31:37 PM
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John, steel is definitely takes solder. Sometimes it takes a little more flux, but it shouldn't if it's bright & shiny.
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Posted - November 09 2012 : 4:41:30 PM
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Sorry not to be specific, but yes, I am referring to steel wire, as per the K&S kind I buy at Hobbytown.
I have accumulated a range of 5 sizes, .020 being the smallest, as I have become more proficient in benchwork.
I have successfully soldered steel wire, by scuffing it with wet/dry garnet paper, then tinning each component before assembling together. This was shown on my little scale test car when I remade the sign poles that mount above the car.
The second of my MDTs has large diameter wire that the previous owner drilled and glued in place. I will remove those later on and make both MDTs uniform in wire grab size.
Just didn't want to buy anything else right now- gotta save for the Xmas flea market I will attend 8/9 December.
Ron
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Posted - November 09 2012 : 6:09:58 PM
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Ron, the original wire for those grabs is .020", so you're fine. Most older handrails are .020" wire, and the MDT is oversized anyway.
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Posted - November 09 2012 : 7:27:25 PM
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.020 it shall be.
Now, on the other MDT with the oversized grabs already installed, the original owner just drilled and bent the large wires.
My best guess is to fill the large holes with a glue- softened putty of styrene, then sand and re-drill for the .020 wire. I am not sure Squadron Putty is going to adhere sufficiently to the sides of each hole to resist pressure (though slight) from re-drilling a new smaller hole, without just popping out.
Any thoughts on that before I screw things up?
Ron
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Posted - November 09 2012 : 10:46:30 PM
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Ron,
on filling holes, I would "fill" the hole, with some sort of round styrene rod.....I get rod, the same size as a common drill bit, 1/16th or 3/32nd....etc, and drill a hole, DO NOT allow the bit to spin freely in the shell side, as it will enlarge to the point that the styrene rod will adhere too, use Tenax 7R OR similar glue to add the section of rod, cut flush on the inside, and do the same on the outside, once trimmed glue again, sand or use a scotchbrite to smooth the surface, then go and add a single coating of your wifes "Clear fingernail polish" this is Lacquer based, and will fill in scratches deep or not as its thick! allow to dry, hit it again with a scotchbrite, and see what it looks like as to "see" under light any surface scratches, and fill again if needed with the clear fingernail polish. once the surface where you just "filled" is to your liking, paint with any paint you use and your golden!
I use this same technique on relocating horns to fill in the original holes drilled or casted that way! BUT, I use 1/8 inch styrene rod, with a 1/8th inch drill bit! As those holes are normally in larger flat areas, unlike the handrail, your going to be sanding around rivet detail and would want the filler as small in diameter as possible!
~John
Many have tried to, and failed, ya just can't repair stupid...
Do NOT try to Idiot-Proof anything!!!! God, will simply create a better......IDIOT!
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Posted - November 10 2012 : 12:56:30 AM
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John, where do you get the smaller dia. music wire? My LHS can only get it down to .015".
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Posted - November 10 2012 : 01:11:03 AM
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Nelson,
My local hardware store carries it.....Its no K&S, and I am not sure what brand it is, but its all but exact to the K&S line, just a more thin diameter they have! I'll have to look the next time I go in!
(They actually carry it now specifically for the local modelers) as there are alot of us! They even have a sheet styrene section that has 2 foot by 2 foot sections of it for $2.00 to $10.00 a sheet depending on what your looking for!
~John
Many have tried to, and failed, ya just can't repair stupid...
Do NOT try to Idiot-Proof anything!!!! God, will simply create a better......IDIOT!
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Posted - November 10 2012 : 5:15:01 PM
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John:
I had some .040 Evergreen plastic rod styrene in my supplies, and a few strokes of a knife around the circumference brought it down into tight fit range for the existing holes in the previously grab-iron mounted MDT. I cut the rod inside and out flush, then secured each "dot" with model master glue from the inside.
I have a bottle of Model Master Flat Clear Laquer Finish that I have laying around,
not opened yet. Would this be equivalent to the wife's clear nail polish you referred to,
regarding sanding scratches?
I am sanding the outside dots only slightly with 1000 wet/dry garnet paper (Walmart Automotive Accessories- where else?). Then I will make the new grabs for both MDT
units and CA them on the inside.
Ron
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Posted - November 10 2012 : 10:11:36 PM
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Ron,
Sounds GREAT...... question tho, how "thick" is the Model Masters Flat Clear Lacquer? As the thickness of the liquid is what "fills" the seam and scratches of any sort as the clear finger nail polish is "self leveling"
With the filling of scratches or the circular seam, you want the clear coat to be thick, to fill the cracks, but thin enough to self level, see?
IF its shinny, it won't hurt it as a scotchbrite works wonders on a shinny surface!
Take a tooth pick.....clean one, unused. Dip it all the way to the bottom of the bottle of Testors Model Masters Flat Clear Lacquer, pull up out of the bottle, suspended just above the bottle, and see if the clear lacquer drips off the tooth pick, with 3 to 4 drops as soon as its pulled out of the bottle, this should be a good thickness for filling, if LESS then 3 drops drop off the tooth pick, its too thin, for filling scratches or separations on the glue joint.
Make sense? Let me know as I'll help you with it!
~John
Many have tried to, and failed, ya just can't repair stupid...
Do NOT try to Idiot-Proof anything!!!! God, will simply create a better......IDIOT!
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