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 Posted - August 27 2012 : 11:32:38 AM
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As I said I would do, here is a photo comparison of a standard Tyco Redbox streamliner and a re-boxed American Flyer streamliner.
The Canadian Pacific is an AF car, and the B&O is a Tyco.
First, a comparison of the cars' lengths. The AF car is about 3/4" longer than the Tyco:
The AF car sits slightly lower on the track:
The curves on the end of the Tyco car are a lot smoother. Also note the molded on marker lights on the AF car:
The opposite ends of the cars are almost identical:
Roof detail comparison. All of the AF cars have a smooth section running down the center of the roof. Also note the placement differences of those little squares (vents?):
Slight differences in the side detail. If you look closely, you'll notice that the little vents are molded differently. Tyco used a pattern of criss-crossing lines, while AF had a circle molded inside the square:
The undersides are virtually identical. The AF car uses the same coupler style as the early Tycos (a horn hook lacking the tail, using a small wire for tension):
If you have any questions or want more pictures let me know 
-cheez
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Posted - August 27 2012 : 12:05:45 PM
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| Illuminating pictures! Thanks Cheez, --Thomas
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waw47
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Posted - August 27 2012 : 12:10:48 PM
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DaCheez, the undersides are virtually identical because Mantua/Tyco fabricated both bottoms.
American Flyer only supply the shells. The American Flyer HO passenger cars have blacken metal bottoms and different trucks on them.
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Posted - August 28 2012 : 10:09:50 AM
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Well, I learned something new today  . It seems odd that Tyco would go to the trouble of making a chassis for another manufacturer's car, rather than just designing their own streamliners right off the bat. 
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Posted - August 28 2012 : 10:29:13 AM
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I too have learned something, I never knew that AF was so close to the TYCO's of the same car type with slightly different details and tooling.
VERY interesting on all of the above!
~John
Many have tried to, and failed, ya just can't repair stupid... 
Do NOT try to Idiot-Proof anything!!!! God, will simply create a better......IDIOT!
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Posted - August 28 2012 : 11:12:47 AM
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DaCHeez is DaMan!
Good show!
Sean
"If everything seems under control, you're not going fast enough!" - Mario Andretti!
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 Posted - August 28 2012 : 11:35:21 AM
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This is a really good post, Eric. I've been wondering about these differences myself but haven't yet acquired an AF/long Tyco streamliner to compare.
I'd always figured Tyco shortened them by chopping a section out of the middle (note the letterboard size spans 3 windows on the AF car and only 2 on the Tyco), but the differences are quite numerous and more comprehensive. To what you detailed, also note the fluting on the sides and roof is completely different: it's coarser, deeper, and more uniform on the AF cars. Beyond the AWOL marker lights, the observation end roof contours and profile are completely different as well. Doors on the Tyco are wider and not as sharply detailed. Add in the roof vent location and detail changes, etc, and it's like Tyco tooled a completely different car. Perhaps they were "required" to do so, even if they used the AF as a base. It wasn't a simple clone-and-shrink job, that's for sure.
Edited by - spiderj76 on August 28 2012 11:39:15 AM
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Posted - August 28 2012 : 6:44:56 PM
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| I'm glad you guys found this informative! When I get around to opening them up I'll post a picture of the guts. I don't imagine they'll be very different from their Tyco counterparts, but who knows
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Posted - January 10 2016 : 4:17:37 PM
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Here is a set of three of the Canadian Pacific gilbert cars sold by Tyco. Maybe 1965 ?
combine T520B . coach T521B. observation T522B. If confused count windows. I got them today at Metuchen train show.
frank.
toptrain
" It's a Heck of a Day " !!!
Edited by - toptrain on January 10 2016 8:40:43 PM
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Posted - January 10 2016 : 6:17:04 PM
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I remember someone here mentioning that Tyco only sold the AF cars in 1959. '59 was the first year the plastic cars were cataloged and supposedly by 1960 Tyco had switched over to their version of the streamliners. I can't confirm that though so take it with a grain of salt.
Nice set, Frank!
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Posted - January 10 2016 : 8:57:55 PM
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quote:I remember someone here mentioning that Tyco only sold the AF cars in 1959. '59 was the first year the plastic cars were cataloged and supposedly by 1960 Tyco had switched over to their version of the streamliners. I can't confirm that though so take it with a grain of salt.
Nice set, Frank!
Originally posted by DaCheez - January 10 2016 : 6:17:04 PM
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I just checked. In HOseeker, tyco catalogs, 1959, 1960, 1961, 1962. all show streamline passenger cars to be Gilbert type. there is no 1963 catalog and 1964 show smaller cars.
I changed the photo in my last post to show window comparison.
frank
toptrain
" It's a Heck of a Day " !!!
Edited by - toptrain on January 10 2016 8:59:30 PM
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waw47
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Posted - January 11 2016 : 10:21:30 AM
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The Gilbert Shell Tyco Passenger Cars are only known to exist in B&O and Canadian Pacific. The 1959 Tyco Catalog shows eight window plastic passengers cars in only B&O and Canadian Pacific. The 1960 Tyco Catalog shows that plastic passenger cars were available in B&O, CP , NH and SF. There are no known examples of New Haven or Santa Fe Gilbert Shell Tyco Passenger cars. In 1961 Tyco added DRG, CB&Q, ACL, UP and Southern to their passenger car offerings. There are no known examples of Gilbert Shell Tyco Passenger for these road names either.
Gilbert coaches have eight large windows on each side. Tyco coaches only have seven large windows on each side. If you look at the Passenger Sets shown in the 1961 catalog, they only have seven windows (CB&Q, B&O, NH and Rio Grande). The 1960 Catalog list a New Haven Passenger Set (T617) with two different eight window coaches (#6203 and #6201). These coaches appear to be factory prototypes. If you look at the illustrations of the passenger sets from the 1961 catalog going forward, you will see that they all contain seven window coaches. Tyco did not update the artwork for individual coach listings until the 62/63 catalog.
As for Gilbert Shell CP Passenger Cars being made in 1965, Gilbert ceased producing HO Trains in 1963.
Allegedly, a deal was made between Gilbert and Tyco. Tyco would produced the 1959 FY&P Frontier Set for Gilbert and Gilbert would supply Tyco with plastic passenger car shells in 1959.
Edited by - waw47 on January 11 2016 10:26:55 AM
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