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 Posted - February 17 2013 : 3:48:17 PM
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I lumped this in with a small cache of locos from my all-time favorite train show dealer, and it basically comes out to free. And maybe by some accounts it should have been:
It's clearly been dunked in paint and has seen better days, but for an HO Rectifier, the price was definitely right. But was it a Lionel or Athearn?
After soaking the right side in 90% alcohol for 20 minutes, a scrub revealed more history: it was dunked black before red. And when I peeled some of the paint off, the letters "V I R" were stuck to the black layer... sigh. Looks like I can't salvage the oringinal paint beneath, but it was worth a shot.
Both Lionel AND Athearn had the Virginian roadname, so no ID there. The frame and mechanism would hold the answer then, but wait - there's more to this puzzle!
Yeah... that's not like any Athearn or Lionel mechanism I've ever seen. I know Athearn's original "gear drive" was sort of exotic, but was it quite this so? LOOK AT THAT MOTOR!
Oh... and after a bit of clean-up, it runs. Superbly.
OK... so Athearn tooled the Rectifier shell at Lionel's behest, at it was designed to ride Athearn's own GP7 shell. So maybe then, this is some sort of bonus 3rd-party vendor upgrade to a standard Athearn geep frame that found its way underneath this messed up rectifier shell...?
Not so...
Somehow it didn't photograph, but the word "JAPAN" is very faintly embossed on the bottom of the tank. And it doesn't fully match an Athearn geep frame either...
Also, back to the shell: how are the pantographs mounted? Every photo I've seen shows screws which would of course be easy to remove, but mine does not use screws. They appear to be pins. I'm afraid to mess with them for fear of breaking them... because underneath all that awful paint, the shell is perfect and unbroken.
SO WHO MADE IT AND WHO RUINED IT AND OMG WHY SO MANY QUESTIONS THIS THING IS A HOBBYNIGMA
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 Posted - February 17 2013 : 5:49:23 PM
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well the blue looks abit like Conrail blue
Virginian, PRR & Conrail had these locos once
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waw47
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Posted - February 17 2013 : 9:16:42 PM
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The Virginian Rectifier was sold by Lionel in 1958 and was a rubber band drive unit. It has "Built by Lionel" stamped on the short hood. The Athearn unit is also rubber band drive and has 0590 stamped on it. It was available in 1958 & 59. Both versions used pins to attach the pantograph.
From your picture, there appears to be a trace of the "Built by Lionel" on the short hood. My guess is someone changed the frame and drive on the unit. By the way, Lionel produced the shells. Athearn painted and decorated the units and supplied the drives.
Edited by - waw47 on February 17 2013 11:28:04 PM
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Posted - February 18 2013 : 12:27:14 AM
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Thank you for the information and Athearn / Lionel clarifications, waw47. So given the base paint and the pins, looks like a 1958-only Lionel version shell? Pity what happened to it.
I agree the frame and motor definitely is aftermarket, but I'd love to know who made it. It's pretty robust, the trucks all fully enclosed with precision-fit brass worms axles and bearings, and the vertical gearboxes are kind of unique. Runs really nice for its era. Given the mounting lugs it seems made for Athearn geeps.
Anyway, I'm going to remove as much of the red and black paint as I can. The original finish is irreparably destroyed, BUT the resultant patina is kind of interesting. It truly does look like a real-life unit that's been subject to neglect and weathering over decades - the kind you see withering away at small-time RR museums and such. Pretty hard to mimic that intentionally... I can always repaint it properly later.
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Posted - February 18 2013 : 02:40:27 AM
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quote:I agree the frame and motor definitely is aftermarket, but I'd love to know who made it. It's pretty robust, the trucks all fully enclosed with precision-fit brass worms axles and bearings, and the vertical gearboxes are kind of unique. Runs really nice for its era. Given the mounting lugs it seems made for Athearn geeps.
Originally posted by spiderj76Â -Â February 18 2013Â :Â 12:27:14 AM
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Hi Tony,
The chassis might be an Olympic Express.
Frank has posted a photo of one in this thread.
http://www.tycoforums.com/tyco/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=9120
Ray
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waw47
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Posted - February 18 2013 : 08:47:06 AM
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| Lionel released the 0581 Pennsylvania Rectifier in 1960 and the New Haven 0591 Rectifier in 1959 thru 1960. Both units had Lionel frames and drives. 1960 was the last year that Lionel offered the Rectifiers.
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Posted - February 19 2013 : 07:04:48 AM
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| Athearn may have initially produced the shell or done assembly on the models, as they also sold the Rectifier as an Athearn product for a short time.
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waw47
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Posted - February 19 2013 : 10:32:26 AM
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| The Virginian rectifier shell was produced by Lionel. Both the Lionel and Athearn versions have the Lionel part number located inside the shell (0590-5).
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Posted - February 20 2013 : 3:13:08 PM
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Ah, kids: the universe's favorite free radicals, randomizers, and wreckers of many a best-laid plan...
So the other day I laid the other half of the shell in the same shallow alcohol bath, fully intending to come back to it in about the same amount of time (maybe less), and remove the upper strata of paint to pursue that "faded original" look I thought would be interesting.
It was late, it was quiet, it was calm, it was close to bedtime, it was a great idea.
And then the kids were kids with the chaos and sillyness and ensuing fallout distractions...
...and around lunchtime the next day, I had one of those dreaded "oops" moments. The kind normally spelled more like "Oh $#!^"...
Well at least I now know with certainty who made it. I guess kids also make good detectives by proxy.
Still, it's pretty neat that paint can peel off that way. After 18+ hours in the bath, the underlying blue came off as well. Oops. 
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Posted - February 20 2013 : 4:05:04 PM
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Tony, save the paint pieces. you never know... Lionel collectors might pay big bucks for them on eBay. 
It's funny... you posted this thread right after I found these rectifiers and added them to my watch list.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/261168526353
http://www.ebay.com/itm/360590780810
They were just rubber band drives, though. That Olympic drive is impressive! I guess that's the design Athearn copied for their Dual Drive. I have one on an F7 chassis, and the shafts and gearing are quieter than their blue box drives.
The Tyco Depot
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Posted - February 22 2013 : 05:46:44 AM
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What a neat find. I'd be glad and probably satisfied to have one in this condition. Good eye.
Alco Fan
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Posted - February 22 2013 : 11:25:49 AM
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well at least you know it was in Virginian & made by Lionel
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Posted - February 22 2013 : 12:56:56 PM
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| gutted,tony,know how you must be feeling,but remember someone else made the same error before i hope ken
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Posted - February 22 2013 : 6:37:20 PM
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Interesting that one nicely custom painted Union Pacific sold for more than one that was in decent original paint and the Athearn version at that. Maybe the paint loss was a blessing - paint it something goofy and see what it brings.
As an aside, if I thought I could pick one or two of these up in decent shape, even painted, for under $20 I'd grab them.
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Posted - February 22 2013 : 7:48:15 PM
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| Hey Tony. What does the shell look like? When I first saw those mangled pictures I thought it was a melted shell, but now I see it's only the paint. Is the engine itself still intact?
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Posted - February 24 2013 : 12:16:28 PM
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Incredibly (especially considering its age and abuse) the shell is 100% intact - nothing broken, chipped, or missing save the rear headlight lens. It's almost completely gray plastic now but I've not had time to finish what I my kids started... I'll post some more pics once it's clean.
Right now I'm toying with how to paint it. I almost want to paint it back to Virginian... but I might go a custom what-if route. Maybe Milwaukee Road, or even the STC. But I have about 30 paint projects and undecs in the works, so... yeah. Not holding my breath yet.
I did keep that "Built by Lionel" paint chip tho...
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Posted - February 24 2013 : 9:03:19 PM
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In my mind I think it would look cool done up like something out of an old comic book. Maybe black with lime green stylized lettering on the side that says "RECTIFIER"...give it some lightning bolt decals and a coloured headlight and you're good to go
Seriously though, I am interested to see what you do with it 
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Posted - February 25 2013 : 12:50:20 AM
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| I'd paint it like it was a prototype model for a never released paint scheme. Milwaukee would work for that. Or something wierd like Rock Island red and black, or Atlantic Coast Line purple and silver...
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Posted - April 26 2013 : 10:02:01 PM
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That chassis is originally Athearn. Originally called a "dual geared geep" for marketing. I have a complete one, and power trucks for another. VERY smooth and quiet, if you clean the hardened grease out and lube it.
They are not like the plastic, in that lack of maintenance doesn't hurt much. These have oillite bearings that need to be kept damp.
http://www.hoseeker.com/assemblyexplosionAthearn/athearngp9dualgeared1957pg1.jpg
Shell swap, probably.
I have been told they only did it for one, maybe two years, until they found they could compete with snap-together plastic gearboxes instead of cast, machined, and tapped boxes with bearings pressed in.
Olympic Express....I know Olympic Cascadian, possibly Irv sold off the line to someone else, but it sure is the same as my dual-geared unit is.
Might be interesting to have one of each and compare.
If it's Japanese, the threads will be metric. Mine are 2-56, as are the ones in the drawing linked.
Dave
Edited by - ScaleCraft on April 26 2013 10:40:44 PM
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Posted - April 26 2013 : 10:05:23 PM
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As an addendum, the sideframes should be plastic. Mine was missing one, found one, and they are Globe (predecessor to Athearn's plastic stuff). They glue on to the metal tabs provided.
You can even see the stock Athearn Geep "air tanks" on the frame.
I don't have an image hosted elsewhere or I'd post photos of my Geep and drive.
Dave
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Posted - April 27 2013 : 11:25:32 PM
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This is my Dual Geared Geep with shell removed. Dave
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Posted - May 28 2013 : 12:58:26 PM
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quote:After soaking the right side in 90% alcohol for 20 minutes
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What brand alcohol did you use Tony?
I am trying to strip paint off of a bunch of Atlas FP7 shells and the brake fluid I normally use is just not cutting it. I tried the rubbing alcohol we had in the house and after a full day of soaking, I had lacking results as well.
Thanks,
Sean
"If everything seems under control, you're not going fast enough!" - Mario Andretti!
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Posted - May 28 2013 : 1:15:07 PM
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** I am glad you guys got the mystery solved. Little bitts of correct info came out from time to time and a lot of cooperation was done. That beast of a motor and those weights surrounding the drive connectors to the tower gears is Olympic Express, what ever Tony said. Sean has a few more, than a few, of those E-33.
frank
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Posted - May 28 2013 : 1:36:02 PM
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quote:** I am glad you guys got the mystery solved. Little bitts of correct info came out from time to time and a lot of cooperation was done. That beast of a motor and those weights surrounding the drive connectors to the tower gears is Olympic Express, what ever Tony said. Sean has a few more, than a few, of those E-33.
frank
Originally posted by toptrain - May 28 2013 : 1:15:07 PM
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Had I seen the topic earlier, I could have solved the chassis mystery. I just sold an Olympic Express GP7/9 chassis last week for $26. I have seen a few of them over the years... not many though.
Sean
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